A plea to singularitarians and their messengers

I like to tell my friends and family about the technological advances, the potential singularity, longevity, the abundance of goods, all the things to possibly come which are common knowledge to the transhumanist/singularity-community.

Who of them knew about the singularity before I bring up the topic?

None of them. “Them” being in the film industry like me, some are retirees/parents or just people I meet by chance. They are pretty much a cross-section of the mainstream population in countries I have friends in: Austria, Poland, Germany, Hongkong, Serbia, Mexico, USA – nobody knew anything about a singularity, a Ray Kurzweil, 3D printers and the tsunami of possibilities that races towards us.

The singularity with all its consequences is unknown to the citizens of Earth. I am not talking about 3rd world people with no access to information. I mean us. Our neighbors, co-workers, friends and families who are online all day. None of them knows.

But they should.

The singularity, in whatever form it may arrive, needs much more awareness. It is a goal worth working and living for and that’s what people want and need. It’s the kind of positive sci-fi Neal Stephenson is asking for: We are not heading towards a dystopian future of miserableness; we are heading towards Utopia. People need to know and understand. But, even now when I am writing these lines, I feel the urge to be very careful about how to deliver the message to the people around us, because of how outlandish some of the more exciting things down the road can appear to people. Immortality? Multiple bodies and/or identities? Brain-uploads? Interstellar mind transfers? Most of the stuff that seems possible is far beyond any science fiction movie and yet we rely on fictional references so much.

It is so easy to turn people into tech-scared luddites, or come across as esoteric prophets, a new wave of scientologist nutcases. Many articles and papers about the singularity contain quite an amount of pop culture quotes: Movies, TV-series, comics, etc. and while I guess, everybody can understand the analogies you guys love to make with The Matrix or The Terminator: I think this takes away the earnestness of the endeavor and makes the argument for the singularity sound like esotericism, because quoting fiction to support actual developments is a) not quite rigorous and b) mostly garnished with negativity, because in all those movies/books/etc technology and machines are usually the bad guys or used by them in the attempt to destroy humanity – technology is the enemy. They completely lack what Stephenson wishes for: A positive outlook.

I might have a cultural bias on this, because I am surrounded by western/US-American media (I live in Austria), but I notice this bias also seems to affect the development of AI/robotics, at least in the way they are fed to us by the media: The impression I get is that western society (most of it originating from the USA) is investing its resources on the development of aggressive AI (weaponry), whereas Asia, especially Japan, seems to seek a more humane usage of machines (maybe because in their pop-culture machines are not the bad guys). This is the impression I get from watching demo-videos of AI-systems on Youtube so many times. Either the media distorts reality or fiction and reality seem to mirror each other quite efficiently in our cultural spaces.

The fiction in our culture paints a dark image of the future and we need to be careful and concentrate on the positives without those fictional references. In its “only bad news is good news”-attitude the mainstream media will do its worst to exaggerate every word uttered by futurists anyways. Let’s not pre-feed them.

I feel, the appearance of the singularity movement is on the borderline of coming across as religious group or prophecy and this needs to be avoided at all costs because it will just slow down and delay everything we are working for. Today, many of the people who propagate the singularity are highly intelligent and educated nerds, freaks, fanboys, drifters far off the mainstream population.

You must not lose them and walk ahead without them, even we are in a hurry because we (the transhumanists, not yet the mainstream) want to live forever and become omniscient gods. It’s not the machines who take our hand today. It is you, the ones who will build them, who have to hold humanity’s hand and lead the rest of us into the future. Don’t leave us behind. And don’t crush our fingers.

38 Responses

  1. Wow, Peter I feel bad for you with all these comments most of which are, honestly, incomprehensible. What I did comprehend was mostly nonsense.

    I absolutely agree with you that it is important to share these ideas with friends and family, find ways to explain how they are relevant and important to their lives, individually.

    I used to be optimistic that as things ramped up in speed, the changes would be so obvious and dramatic that there would be a collective epiphany that the near future is going to be dramatically different. However, considering where we are today and the fact that no one is particularly impressed with it, I’m not so certain.

    By the time the future gets here, it tends to have become thoroughly boring. When autonomous cars make up 99% of the cars on the road, there will not be a collective celebration of achievement, but instead a sentiment of “well it’s about time”. If a technology is new, it hasn’t fulfilled its potential. Once it fulfills its potential, its no longer new, so boring. Smartphones are a great example of this.

  2. db says:

    I meant to say Tesla when i was talking about the Master Magician, a title that Edison carried before him. I also was saying that it was Tesla who ‘put the whole thing in motion, but it was actually only hosXjonery his patents with westinghouse that got the big thing rolling. It just hit me this evening where the miniscile big bangs, so to say, really took place, and the impact of that had me rolling on the porch in laughter. I have to digest that for a bit before i say anymore on that though. However, i will make an anology of what i realized and sorry, this time we are using Disney and Aladins Genie. Because i used to think qbout God and Jesus u know and how Jesus waa like the Genie in that you’ve got Aalll this power, this Biggg god, this Energy packed into this ittie bittie dwelling place. Like the god in Jesus and that Genie in the bottle and now we are talking about putting Aall that energy that the great scientists and backers got rolling and we are looking for a way to put that into these ittie bitty dwelling places. These bodies. Only and Peter you have appreciate this at least. Now we have all all of these bodies to dicidenit ip in in a way which is what Jesus was wanting to do when his people were being called the body of Christ. It really is quite himorous if you know the language and the concepts amd magnormity of that!

  3. db says:

    So to be clear, i am the author of the maTeriAl Nd stories of sAharA shee in the nutshell and about my thoughts one day a out being left behind and Horato on CSI assuring me that night that quote unquote
    Debi there are worst things then being left behind.

    I am no longer willing to be as transparent as i was in the agreement i mAde when i and my grandparents were in the tunnels. I have used the knowledge of those blogs in other posts when necessRy but in speaki g to other people on activist sites i have ways tried to be uplifting and encoracing or and elswhere up to now only to be able to

    plain why i sY the things thAt i do say. Do not worry, i am past those concerns in that
    one i simply do not or will not own a television although there is an old one in my home right now that is not plugged in.
    I am no longer co cerned about where my private writings go to although i do try to keep stock of what information or rantings i talk about while journaling
    I no longer talk about all information that i am aware of even in my written journals.
    What i do Nd am doing in regards to my personal posts on we sites is try to uplift and discuss issues of life todY with the people. What i am doing also now is creTing a book that is meant to help or point leoe towards thT process of discovering where they fit into these wirlds while still maintining self. Each self being important in that this is what the whole is made up of. Self being vital to know for it is from there that we gain the spark Nd chRge to keep the whole of us goung. I am not talking esotericly but about the electromagnetics of man
    which caN be measured. Nor am inspeaking condemingly of those who opened up the whole gd can of worms when came to this earth to be nithing BUT a walking talking self ,as well as other minds with him self thinking master magician of the highest order. Bow could one condemn such a magnificent brain! However neither do i hesitate, nor would i if he stood before me now to sAy hey slow down and think about this becUse i can tell what is going to happen if you are not careful and this gets into the hands of people who are not so benevolent to our welfare.
    Actually Peter we, you and sno and i are sYing many of the sMe things differently.

  4. db says:

    I used to be easily found under
    The name starrdusk but i have shut down all of those
    Sites they were
    The Blogs that contained
    Either my blogs or my paintings. My name also used ro be found under many other listings but it has been a few months since i have appeared anywhere. I dont know why the federation of light is the only one that i am on. There was another site under the federation of light but it is no longer found. Which is too bad because i had listed that at one time as a source for information concerning the origins of many of our interplanetary brothers and sisters

  5. db says:

    Sno is. correct if i am not misunderstanding when he sAys that a van guard is needed

  6. db says:

    Peter, i have a logged in membership the federation of light which i am not affiliated with other than one or two. Comments I have made. I was exploring it and find that we have very little in common or at least not common enough to keep my interest.
    I did get you and sno confused.

  7. db says:

    There is enough in your article to lead me to believe that you have read my material alredy when you speak of the new wave of scientologist nutcases and being left behind being included in your discourse of the use of movies and media stories, which i have spoken to above. If, Peter, I speak out of turn and you have no knowledge of my work then it is the singularity of the system at work as these references to what i have spoken in my works are cropping up all over the place in clusters. If THis is the case my dear boy and it is the system and not you or the people who are clustering these references the. The system is working through me and it is wanting me to tell you of the perils and not all of the good only which, by the way the system this AI is not interested in my good stories about big brother. That is, if it is indeed the system and not you or other people who wNt these brought out agIn or co tinued. As to speKing no longer of the weaknesses with in the system i do not so much for kne reason. I do not intend to teach the system how to read the singular mind so that it can duplicate or try to duplicate completly enough for one not to be able to tell the difference between selfness and the incorporated mind.

  8. db says:

    Which, on the other hand, you seem to do by constructing, from what I think, you might consider a worst-case-scenario from your perspective

    I have, in the posts above constructed and spoke of the benefits in the future. Those that i have spoke of above are one of the out comes.
    I have never stated Any contempt towards the scien es nor the men of the sciences who are pressing to curther these advances except for
    A those who would press with out recognizing the perils of a wholy singular global society of incorporation in to the system of the global one mind and community. I speak to those and many other of the comments of these posts above

    I hAve indeed included the worst case senario as well as the benificial in my other writings on these matters. What would you have me to say, Peter?

  9. db says:

    Sno. When you complain about the movie the Matrix being false you must consider that perhaps it is one of those lives who has become aware of the cyclick nature of our lives. It is most highly likely thay we have already done this. It is, if not most likely then entirely possible as long as their are beings like myself who cannot go fully into this nature even if you kill them. The energy that lives with in them continues to live. You, as a nonspiritual person may wish to disregRd that statement but IF you are even looking at the idea of putting human intelligence and brAin activity into a mechanical body, bio or otherwise then you must recognize that there is a brain activity that is pure energy, right? And that some energies are stronger and that live on somewhere on this earh in some form.

  10. db says:

    I have spoken also on my websites about the going into this one mind either slowly or quickly and a few of the wow facors. I personally can only take so many if the wow factors which are semi-covered in my stories in the tunnels where everything is being designed for the AIntelligence, but it is not artificial. All if the minds and reactions as well as the souls, the psyche of those in these homes are captured into the Motherboard Sarah. Sarah is is being built with in the tunnels lined and then later used to gather all of the personalities collectively into herself. I earlier said that she brings in the soul payche as well. The enotional aspect. Which is done by capturing the sound as well as the vibrations of the sounds into her sensitive walls. The sensitivity of the walls and the atmosphere captures our brain waves theough the elecromagnetics of the material of which sarah is built.
    There is a te during this story where all of the bodies have then been freeze dried, which, with the underatanding that they now no longer contain any portion of themselves because that has been removed and put into the walls of Sarah, this is the same as saying that they are dead. However, I did hear feom one of them that woke up from with in the walls on one part of our journey when i caused Sarah to enter another time current while we were drifting through space. This was an electromagnetic current that was much fastor than our own and , while it did mot affect Saeah adversely, it did affect myself and ar least a few if the ither minds who were on the craft. These were those who could not be put to sleep completly because our brain make up is a bit different than the rest of those aboard.
    There are minds Sno that cannot go into a one mind existence. It is impossible for them to do so and it is they very much who is needed to supply the, I want to say energy, i want to say power simply the life force that keeps the charge of life going. Circulating.
    This being said there must be considered as you plan a consideration of those that you deem are standing in the way pf progress in this area of technological and AI advancement. Can an intelligent man made computer be made capable of breaking out of all of the quos and factors of all of human mind so that it can continue to keep life going beyond merely the mexhanical which seeves no purpose but to keep the Universe spinning on its wheels? I have not had a chance ro read the book can robots dream, but this is the question.
    When you give them good desceiptions of something perhaps they can envision it by what they already have been programmed with but can they dream neuons thay. Or are they destined to continue forever and all eternity going in the same old circles. Perhaps that is why so much of our own global existence is spent going in circles. By this I mean the consistent and cyclical wars and countriea fighting for what the other has and wants, the Religions that insist on making their ways around the world teying to get everybody to nelieve as they do and to own the greater mumber of souls; the hinger and poverty that crops ip and diea down ober and over again around the globe. Perhaps we have already been brought into that AI alignment and are now reliving the one where we are
    Preparing to make the decision of whether we should bring us all into artificial intelligence. Perhaps that is how i have been living those dreams and visions and actual physical experiences of the One Mind.

  11. db says:

    Ii have been talking for years, at least 4 years in my blogs as well as on site in my FB and on many other pages about Robotics and a
    One mind technology that we we are working on. I have just discovered a new term, singularity, which includes the culture as well as the literal/virtual one mind.
    This magazine, Hplusmagazine.com
    is about transhumans, another name for this area of work. This magazine talks about the work that is being done now in this area as well as provides a place where you, where we can begin to respond and learn about it and voice our opinions. Keep in mind, the work that is being done has been goung on far longer than i have been living it. I have told you this already also when i said that ANY information that we receive now through media of any sort in these things are going to be way behind the actual and present progress in these projects. Because of this, Some of these arricles in this magazine are hypothetical while others are actual works that are being done in the labs and field. But what about where we actually are with this work that has not been reported?

    My blogs if you recall are from one who has been living in and fighting that world as well as commenting from a motherboard viewpoint at seeing others who have no choise Nd often no recognition of the times when they respond to her thoughts and become like little walking Debians. Friends I am not coming from a hypothetical viewpoint but from a reality that has been and still is my own. I have also provided examples of times when i have heard on radio things that had not yet occurred and have read on FB posts from a friend about her vacation a week before she actually posted her vacation. Those stories i posted not for entertainment nor to impress you but specifically to let you know that i have and have been living a future that you are not yet cognizantly aware of.

    Begin checking out this magazine and the comments, which are the most important because they give you a wider and sometimes better clue as to where our world is going in the AI phenomena.
    You may Not want to hear this again but i am telling you that if you have any concern or care about your children and their futures, then you will listen. I have also told you that there are pluses to these attachments, for those of you who think that i have been only negitive in this, but/and those pluses must be explored and seperated from the purely natural paychic mind that does not operate nor depend solely on the use of the satalite and web of the internet in order to work.

    I have often OFten allowed myself to believe that this is an inevitable outcome of our evolution and growing minds; however i do know and see that there are many out there left who do not want to nor will they accept this as inevitable. These are the only kind of minds that will help to contol this and stall that inevitability.

    I will leave you with a sentence in one of these articles that represents what we are needing to fight this for. This was spoken by one who feels that the virtues of this system far outweigh the cons, and that those who are left behind in this movement will eventually dissappear. This sentence is one that we need to take stock of and chew on wirh much consideration
    , that

    when these AIs are in place
    this will be the last thing that man will ever (need to) invent.

    In that light it must be understood that all invention has come out of some kind of need be it social or personal. The persoanal even most often translating or becoming a social fix or enjoyment. To that end let us logically rephrase that statement above
    And yes you R welcome to take this as prophecy and make sure you take this out and have it computed and logically and statistically analyzed because what i am saying is that what this author has told usis that

    This will be the last thing that man will ever invent

    I AM going to give you two warnings from other sources concerning the loss of invention and creativity; Religion and science
    One is from a religious text, Proverbs 29:18 which tells us that “With out vision the people perish.” the New King James says that “without vision the people cast off restraint”
    which is another side of the payche techno attchments that i have experienced and warned about.

    The other quote is from the words of a great scientific mind. Although some of us may not agree with all of Einsteins philosophies in every aspect i can tell you that any and all visionaries have been able to see into some future and logically make a prediction as to what a society lacking self thinking individuals would become. Although i say that a visionary scientific mind can make predictions, Einstein has not relied solely on visionary prediction but also upon the Historical development of Countries to come to his conclusive belief that …
    “Without creative, independently thinking individuals and judging personalities the upward development of society is as unthinkable as the development of the individual personality with-out the nourishing soil of the community. “(The world as I see it p 9 albert Einstein)
    Einstein was talking simply about the loss of individuality based on the drive to keep the human mind working as well as controlled with in a human system, warning elsewhere about the dAngers of insisting that we all become a part of the hurd. ( his words, references to come. Below).
    And this is is only within the human understanding.

    Take that to the next logical step of a global transference of the individual into a system that is controlled by one Mind, or Motherboard as you will, where it has already been declared that this is the last thing that man will ever need to invent,
    thus the last thing he ever will invent, and you have just done away with both the human mind as well as rhe himan soul, oe, spirit and psyche.

    On a peraonal note i must make this obsevation for our Christian friends who believe that they do not have to worry about this in their lives: the scripture that i quote above has another part to it. That ‘happy is the man who keeps the Law”. What is that law, but you love your brother in the same way that you would love yourself
    and there is a law unto us that passes across all time, which only works when combined with the law of love for others and self, which is the law of Free Will and, as john locke has said that we all have right to our personal bodieas and mind and this no man has a right to take away from us.

    But believe me when i say that you must must, make your voice heard and stand in agreement to your right as a free rhinking individual. The website i have posted above is simply a beginning

  12. db says:

    Peter…Sno?… You say to Shaggz that you “originally had your concerns about politics, misuse of AI, wrong allocation of resources ( ie, funding projects for solving problems instead of funding AI which would solve the same problem much faster)”” “but that you “removed it becUse it’s really two different pairs of shoes. (As a self walking, self talking self thinking bio-electromagnetic immortal being I can come up with at least two ways to explain what you might mean by those pairs of shoes). Could you explain what You mean by this?

    The only way that has seemed viable to prevent the misuses that has been alluded to in your comments above is if you are actually connected to a Motherboard that holds no such thoughts in her mind nor consciousness of living. Do you understand this?

    • When I read that you consider yourself immortal, I googled your name “Debi K Baughman” – are you affiliated with thefederationoflight.ning.com ?

    • Sno says:

      Just as a clarifier : i’m Sno, i’m not Peter Koller, you’ve been mixing us up after he replied to your reply to my comment.

      Also, to answer some of your questions : as I understand it, “Sigularitarians” are people who think that “the technological singularity” will most likely happen.
      The technological singularity itself would be an event or a period of time in human history, where technological progress, feeding of itself in an accelerating loop, would reach a critical mass of sorts, and bring abrupt and disruptive change to the world, among which an explosive increase in intellect for whoever is taking part in the singularity, be it artificial intelligences or humans augmented through technology (or both). It’s also usually considered that what happens after is almost impossible to guess, because singularity-level intellects would be so far above ours, that it would be like an ant trying to guess what humans are doing.

  13. db says:

    Of course the AI culture is already here. You say that you are not particularly excited about the idea of some people being cognitively enhanced super powered immortal peers. How do you feel about the idea of one ( of those peers) being the motherboard which powers all of the rest of you cognitively enhanced super-powered immortals? Or, just one of those super powered immortals being your mother board so thAt you are programmed to do what she does, think what she thinks feels what she feels with no understanding of the reason of the feelings, and believe what she believes. With no thought of doing, thinking, or believing anything different?

    • “You say that you are not particularly excited about the idea of some people being cognitively enhanced super powered immortal peers.” I neither said this in the article nor meant this between the lines, because I don’t insinuate evil intentions to the people working in the field. Which, on the other hand, you seem to do by constructing, from what I think, you might consider a worst-case-scenario from your perspective. This can be drawn for/against every situation. Human history has shown that every technological advance, no matter how much opposition and demonization and misuse it had to face, has lead to a better world. I see no reason for a sudden change in this trend, so I expect the best-case-scenario and a sunny future, but since this seems to be somewhere around your worst-case-scenario, what would your alternative best-case look like?

      Regarding “motherboards” I am quite in line with German philosopher/neurologist Thomas Metzinger, who assumes “that no such things as selves exist in the world: Nobody ever had or was a self. All that exists are phenomenal selves, as they appear in conscious experience. He argues that the phenomenal self, however, is not a thing but an ongoing process; it is the content of a “transparent self-model”.

      In short, we live the illusion of having a self. He might be wrong, but AGI research, neurology and endeavors like the Human Brain project indicate that this theory seems not far off.

      So, whether my wet sponge inside my skull or some mainframe clusterbug supermachine serves as the mothership of me, myself and everybody will not really be life-changing, because the outcome is the same: me.

      • Sno says:

        I was the one who said that I was “not particularly excited about the idea of some people being cognitively enhanced super powered immortal peers” but i wasn’t talking about the people working in the field, I was talking about how, from my perspective, there would be some danger in enhancing the whole mainstream population.

        I was making the point that perhaps it is best that such power doesn’t go in the hands of those too foolish to use it wisely. And as I see it, the fact that the mainstream population is oblivious to the possibility of an upcoming technological singularity, might very well an excellent natural filter, ensuring that the vanguard will be comprised of the right people for the task.

  14. db says:

    Then lets break it down beginning with a simple question. When you speak of the singularity what exactly are you talking about?

    • Precisely as I wrote in the article: “in whatever form it may arrive”. This article is about (dis)advantagous PR and addressed to the people who work in this field and from the perspective of an interested and curious bystander, who thinks there are a lot of positive and immensely fast approaching technological advancements just behind the horizon, which should be promoted to us (the public), but not with negative connotations.

      20 years ago this article could have focused on our grandparents, who somewhat got left behind by computers, internet and smartphones and hardly learned to adapt to and use them. And since the advances are not really decelerating we should make sure not only to keep the 80+ generation up to speed but all of us.

  15. db says:

    Void the above post as it has too many typo’s. i am still getting ust (phonetics you know. The system seems to like phonetics because one of our biggest sellers of technology has keyboards that insist on spelling that way. Soon we will not have to type or talk at all. Imagine. Wait. Sorry. I forgot that you cannot. You do not need to because you are all
    At Peace)

    The simplest way to say it is, if you do not being and remaining forever and ever just another peg on the post then you are welcome to it
    What are some possible
    Benefits? You will never get lost. You will be going all over the globe answering the call for what is needed on any particular area. Since, being not a particular spiritual person you might not grasp the instinct or and psyche of humans we will say that since each are tied into the mechanics of the main system you will immediately know what is needed across the globe as far as commodities and needs of the earth herself.

    Now i have done the same thing as you. I have switched position on you.
    Q. What do YOu do when you hVe no mind to create?

    Q. If you want no mother board then you are seeing it as being above in which there is no need for a mother board. But is there really no need and who and how would youi choose who would be the mother or would she simply create herself out of the many that are with in the mother board. And there ultimately you have God. So, whether you go about this mechanically or technologically you have a one, right?
    The idea of leaving certain books out of this
    Of the equation is ludicrous; when they do indeed speak of what it will actually look like when another kind of intelligence is implemented. For instance i have used scripture to describe what this world is like and just as i have used pertinate movies to describe it in ways that can be understood. When it is said that all you do and say, that all things that are done in secret will be shouted from the rooftops i have explained HOW this is done via our cable and satellites on top of our homes. And it does get broadcast. and of course our cell phones and all of things that we already know of.
    Although i myself have mentioned that i heard about these things in the church i never gave indication that these things were causing fear of something that i did not know first hand about.
    That being said i will add that words from the Bible, when i see them occurring i have no problem giving them recognition. not bowing in fear that i may be serving a wrong God. What i am saying is take what is right before ones eyes in the material world and do what you will with the spiritual reasons and condemnation. I am not talking about the spritual aspects of it any more than are you but i will tell it like it is, not out if ‘fear’ as you consistently refer to it as, but out of what knowledge i have of it

  16. db says:

    If you are however proposing the one mind in it’s entirety then i would hope that you are one of those who are looking closely at both the pros and
    The cons, for there are both. Very few in the western culture are going to be convinced if you simply tell them that It is good but i cannot tell you why’. Considering that we are already living in a singular thought world, or you have already been there and come back it should be. Easy. I am not being sarcastic here, which id how that would be interpreted in much of western society, i am asking just, what it like to be in this one mind of singular thinking? What makes it so good?

    Because I can vouch for the fact that there extraordinaryally good things about it. I can also biuch that it can be and is being used in not so good ways as well as unscrupulous and deceitful ways. I am saying simply that it is not all wine and roses because of this as a supporter and because you are touching on a subject that brings an end to the need and mind of man to create you are going to have to step out side of it and see if from all possibilities; what could happen if man were capable of obtaining the psyche of all other men and people, and yet their hearts conscious Remain as they are now I speak here not as one who is just being afraid of possibilities but as one who has lived in those possibilities.
    In my earlier reports and past posts on this the very idea that one would use such experiences, or just one experience spoil the whole thing is a. Stupid and contemptible as well;
    nor, according to the comments should the person be even talking about it since it could spoil other peoples acceptance of the move into a publicized ‘what’s yours is mine’ world.

  17. db says:

    Of course the AI culture is already here.

    Snow, what are you doing? First you are saying that it is an extremely bad thing that we have dissenters and are assuming that their dissension is coming from simply things that they have heard.
    Again, people might stand hard against the Utopian culture as far as the owning of things and property goes but they know what they are fighting.

    Sno, my main focus on your article involves the last sentence about AI being the last thing that man will ever (meed to) invent. This one sentence convinces me that you also are against
    The One mind of human attachment and AI.
    If it is the last thing that man will ever need, then it will indeed be the last thing that he will ever invent

  18. Debian says:

    If you are talking specifically about the new culture in which every person owns or has available to them everything, that is one thing and i would not even begin to disagree with the commentor who said that it would be fought against by the pluto crats.
    I will however argue that this is not a religious position, and that this is one instance where you would be harming your own argument not to use their own words to convince many of the Judeo Cristian that this is exactly what their apostles taught that Jesus had in mind. That is one group you would want to begin to convince because that church holds so much sway over the western population

    • zef says:

      No, the author I think is afraid that this will be the way it is conveyed to the general public through the media. I 100% agree that this will set back advancement a very large amount. Already it is going to be hard to get people’s minds on adopting or supporting this without that false terming. You may say “we’ll just develop it anyways,” but funding is going to need to come from the public for a couple reasons. Transparency being a necessary facet, and corporatization needing to be vehemently avoided being two that come forefront to my mind.

  19. Debian says:

    Ok. But let my last two posts
    Go for a moment. A question. What exactly do you mean by singulartarians? I know that it is a word that you use in your circles and those who use the word know what they mean. But on this post i am seeing that it could carry two meanings: one of them being a singular mind in which all humans have been incorperated into a one mind via technology and our computer systems, the other way i heR, or see it being used is in a more “socialistic” way the Utopian culture that is being referred to as the Singularity. Which one are you talking about precisely in your article? The use of the word here, especially in regards to and along with the subject of technology and AI is also the teaching of Jaque
    Fresco and the venus project.
    So i am seeing two different aspects and intentions here.

    • zef says:

      Definitely not a single mind upload. While that will inevitably be an option in the future for people who choose to, it will not be the default and (in my opinion) not the preferred choice. If people do choose so, however, will they really be in your way or interfering whatsoever? What exactly is your particular concern about that scenario?

  20. Sno says:

    In my experience, people are rarely willing to listen to that kind of stuff. Either they don’t understand much, don’t care, or they are already brainwashed into thinking that this kind of future is “wrong” and should be avoided at all costs (Petrus here in the comments is a good example of that).

    In my opinion, most people will be left behind when things will get serious. You could see it as bad, I see it as the natural flow of things. Besides, there aren’t many people that I would like as cognitively-enhanced-superpowered-immortal-peers.

    • Sno says:

      Oh and just as a precision : when I say “left behind” I simply mean that they will keep on living as “humans” while a fraction of us will move on to the next stage of evolution (we might very well coexist peacefully for some time until either the humans go extinct or we leave for some other place/planet/substrate).

      • Debi K Baughman says:

        sorry hunny. left behind? i’ve already been there and back and do not concern myself with that triviality any longer;
        I have been to those other places. nice. will go again. but one does not need your electromagnetics to get there, and where you have been through them has nothing to do with the realities of those places themselves. like I say to the rest of you…dream on. it will only make it easier for the robotics to take you away and you never know it.
        wwIII at its best. it won’t be needed because you will think that you are still of any kind of mind. you may like being virtual, which is a word of false origin to start with, but that will only be because you will not know any reality whatsoever. literally. we all like to dream, and if you are saying here that it is the mind versus the human spirit of true life, then i say that you will be fighting many. you my friends, may know mind, but you have no understanding nor experience with life itself. you are not life. when life ceases, you cease. so this is to say that whether you like it or not, and whether we like it or not, we fight for you as well as life itself.

        • zef says:

          Human civilization is about advancement, plain and simple. We move forward, we don’t stay still. We adapt, we alter and we aggregate. Look how far we’ve come in the past 100 years and tell me wallowing in our current society is where we’ve been heading all along. We won’t forget who we were and who we are, and we certainly won’t stop looking to the future.

      • Debi K Baughman says:

        as for the crushing of the fingers, crushing is not the right word; they will rot off and the reason for that has nothing to do with you unless you are out raping little girls and grown women or boys. don’t worry. there are other things for the mind rapers and media hungry who do not know how to draw their own boundaries.

        • Dear Debi,

          I’m the author of the article and just read both your replies, but I have to confess that English is not my first language and because of this I have to admit that I did not understand the point you tried to make (and which you certainly put into your words).

          Could you possibly rephrase your argument and help me catch your rationale so I could give you a proper reply?

  21. Petrus says:

    I consider your article to be one of the most positive things I’ve read in the last two years. The idea of transhumanism becoming mainstream has motivated me to contemplate suicide in the past. The idea of it being rejected by the majority really gives me a renewed sense of hope.

    The chemtrails/geo-engineering, the elite attempts to destroy the natural environment; I’m aware that all of that is being done by an elite who want to force people into an entirely mechanical/non-biological future, in which we would become perpetual slaves.


    Your singularity is not inevitable, my friend. Some of us are going to fight.

    • zef says:

      Really? Using a fictional setting as an example of the negative possibilities of human augmentation is not only exactly the negative response the author is talking about, but strongly veering in the wrong direction. Obviously we need to prepare for negative outcomes of the production of this technology, but I have firm belief that when augmentation is made more safe, and more broadly available, it will be built with transparency, freedom of use and anti-commerce at the forefront. It all has to do with who develops, and who cries foul when people begin to harness this tech in a way not conducive to an advancement of the human species.

      Sure there will be people that will be better than you because they are augmented. There already are people who are better than you that aren’t and that will NEVER change. There will always be someone better than you and there will always be someone worse than you at any action or skill. Always. So why get all up in arms upon this realization?

  22. shagggz says:

    Utopia is by no means a foregone conclusion. Just because we will have nanofactories doesn’t mean that our plutocrats won’t gin up some absurd IP regime to impose scarcity where it needn’t exist just so they can retain their power. How technology is used is always contingent upon the socioeconomic context it’s in, and preaching the good gospel of singularitarian utopia just increases the chances of us sleepwalking into the user-facing end of the double-edged sword that technology has always been.

    • @shagggz I originally had your concerns about politics, misuse of AI, wrong allocation of resources (ie funding projects for solving problems instead of funding AI which could solve the same problem much faster) roughly in the article, but I removed it because it’s really two different pairs of shoes.

      This article is about the message and its reception singularitarians are sending out to the public. It’s about how the creators steer publicity, they have their cause (AGI, singularity) and politicians have their own cause (simply said: their goal function is maximizing votes).

      Of course, you are right, AI efforts don’t need to lead to Utopia, but this is where we want to end up and what we are heading for with good intentions – and for this goal we should not use dystopian imagery.

  23. nik says:

    The problem is as soon as a technological advanced is presented by the medias, I mean, television, radio, or whatever, it’s always turn in a kind of joke. They used by themselves this stereotypical images.

    hey, terminator is coming soon guys!

    Nothing serious.

    I can understand why, the progress was something ‘slow’ past decade, nothing really surprising. Progress used to follow that gradually advanced, with a constant rythm.
    So why it should change?
    Its a real problem of information and diffusion.

    I live in France and each time that I pop up the word, singularity, it’s a real mystery for my interlocutors. They ending by think that I’m kind of a nerd playing to much video games…I found that definitely sad.

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