THE IMMORTALISTS - a short film by Jason Silva
A MEDITATION ON THE WILL TO BECOME IMMORTAL... a love letter to science and philosophy that explores the idea of engineered radical life extension and biological immortality featuring Ray Kurzweil...
Recent Comments
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Comments
You really have to listen to the reasoning here - it's scary and different therefore we shouldn't do it because somehow, things must remain as they were before and if they don't then all manner of additional scary things will happen and we should all live in mortal fear of scary things.
RIDICULOUS. Cowards!
The reality is that this technology isn't just coming, it's already emerging. There is NOTHING anyone can do to stop it. All you can do is decide for yourself that you will not enjoy it. And please, yes, help us purge the gene pool of this stupidity, this cowardice, the vast ignorance out there that serves to disguise magical superstition under the guise of so many different "reasons" in an attempt to confuse. DO AVAIL yourselves of the choice NOT to participate.
For myself, I will not only help fund it, I will be a happy customer. I will rise to the challenge and educate everyone around me. And if this conversation feels like a kick in the teeth to you or a slap in the face, let me AGAIN encourage you: DO NOT participate.
It's only a matter of time before I'm rid of all this crap.
It's only a matter of time before I'm surrounded by the next generation humans, actual transhumanists and the true heirs of our actual heritage, one of exploration, refinement, COURAGE and education.
And only because I like to encourage it where ever I go, please use your ability to choose: DO NOT participate. Die off like the useless spawn you have always been.
Of course this stuff is possible. To be clear, a term more accurate than "immortality" is indefinite life extension. We can definitely have indefinite life extension, with out a doubt. Science can treat and cure many diseases. Many of those diseases are a lot like the 7 forms of damage that cause our cells to age us to death. A mechanic that can fix a boat motor can fix a car motor. Its really as simple as that. The movement for indefinite life extension just needs the support to get there sooner than later now. This reminds me of the Fable of the Dragon Tyrant, if any of you have read that.
http://www.nickbostrom.com/fable/dragon.html
A good read.
I honestly don't think immortality is possible at all. The science we have now is incapable of creating the genes they were talking about that prevents your body from aging. I don't think such technology or science advancement is going to happen in the near future. If in a million years scientists are capable of creating something like that, it still won't result in immortality. People don't just die of old age, they die in car accidents, fires, ships sinking, plane crashes, gang crimes, there are definitely more ways to die than old age.
On the other hand, who really wants to live forever? If life wasn't short, there wouldn't be much reason to get up and enjoy it now. I disagree with the video, death does define life. People live their lives to the fullest because they know it will end someday, so might as well make the best of it now. Also, living forever and watching the world change in front of your eyes have having to live a different life style than the one you grew up with doesn't sound too appealing... not to me anyways.
Overall I thought that the video was really interesting and thought out. However, I do see some problems with the idea or possibility of immorality. Firstly, I do that our earth was made for everyone in our population to live an infinite amount of time. Resources will begin to dissipate and could cause major issues. Yes our scientific world is becoming more and more technologically advanced and can probably create solutions to some of these problems but eventually the overpopulation will have its effect on our earth. Secondly, I think that saying that immortality will happen within our lifetime is a stretch. I think that it is amazing that they have come so far but I honestly believe that they need to way out more of the risks that can be associated with this large step in our society. Also not everyone wants to live forever, I do not believe that however we were made that we were meant to live an immortal life. I think that they need to do more research and planning and risks assessments before stating that this could happen so soon.
Immortality would be nice, but realistically it seems that the consequences outweigh the benefits. Overpoplution would take into effect and with the increasing number of humans, where will we all go? what will happen to privacy? I am not religious but I do see the harm in wanting to live forever. Greed was the first thing that came to mind when watching this video. It seems selfish to want to keep taking from our earth past our life expectancy. What will be left of our planet if we build and build. People will be forced to live near/in dangerous areas suchs as flood plains, near active volcanoes, and premature slopes that could potential cause landslides. The more people there will be, the more houses, shops, parking spaces, etc. we will need. Mother earth will not look the same or be the same. Also, I would not want to live longer if the aging process was still the same. Yes you have your life but you would also have old age and the aches and pains that are associated with getting older. I believe there are some things that should just not be tampered with. If immortality is actually becoming a possibility, someone did not do a good enough technology risk assesment.
It never fails to amaze me how many short sighted, misinformed, pseudo-religious arguments come up when the prospect of the elimination of aging, death from any cause but misadventure, and a life potentially measured in centuries is discussed.
First, you seem to have fallen for the same old propaganda about overpopulation. Hank Hyena answered that quite throughly here: http://www.hplusmagazine.com/articles/politics/breed-or-not-breed. Population is not an issue. Growth is already falling off, and as more countries modernize, our population will stabilize somewhere between 8 to 10 billion.
Second you have also failed to take into account the advances in technology that are ongoing, many of which involve massively improved resource availability and resource recycling. Between new breakthroughs in Molecular Manufacturing, Print manufacturing, and developing technologies such as in vitro meat, we are rapidly approaching the day when we can easily support 30 billion people on this planet with minimal environmental impact.
Third, you have failed to follow the actual medical progress being made in longevity, or you would be aware that it is research to end AGING, both by preventing the damage aging causes, and by restoring those who have suffered age related deterioration.
All of your objections reveal a profound lack of actual knowledge in all of the areas in which you have raised concern.
I highly recommend you read The Scientific Conquest of Death, released by the Immortality Institute. It can be found here: http://www.imminst.org/SCOD.pdf
I completely agree with everything you have said. Immortality can only create larger issues for our society. If we already can't handle the amount of people on the earth as is, why make it worse by allowing people to live forever. We would never be able to provide for people if this started happening. I believe the circle of life is the way it is for a reason, you are born to live a life then you die. While these immortalists believe it is cruel to take away life from someone I believe it is cruel to make someone live for so long with the same kinds of aging affects. When many people die it is because their body cannot handle the life it is living, if you have a disease you do not want to live in so much pain for so long. Maybe the aging process would be better but i find it hard to believe there will ever come a time where everyone is in their 20's and extremely fit. I also agree with you on the greed factor. Why take more than you need? Or more than was intended to be offered to you? Life is a precious gift that we should embrace and be thankful for everyday, we should not be wasting our lifetime trying to figure out how to make it longer, we should be trying to figure out how to make it better.
There isnt a problem with trying to expand life, however, it would be more wise to try and expand the knowledge of the life we have in a more urent matter, as time has proven over and over again it isnt the time that you have that is valued when your gone, its what you do with the time. Whats the point of living 200 years, if you only do one year worth of positive change, or just being alive for centuries only to never make a change. I have my own solution, how about we find a way to expand life on a rewards based term. Such as all the individuals who make a significant change to world that we know, get a extra 20 years of life to make another significant impact. why just life for no reason when eternal peace only resides in death. Pushing the envolpe scientific is great, but when we start to mismanged the envolope things start to go bonkers. First we learn how genetics work, then we use this imformation to clone and reproduce at an alarmig rate, artificial animals, and vegetables. First we learn how to make fire, then comes gun powder, bombs and war. Theres never anything wrong with pushing the envelope as long as its done responsibly. To allow people to live centuries fue to new technolgy would eb a horrible mistake, because for every JFK, or Obama, there will be a Hitler, or a Staling who lives centuries on in. Sometimes, certain things and certain people are only good in moderation, if any good at all. Would i love to live to see my great great great great great great great great grandkids? Sure, but then again id have to live through each of those generations, and unless scientist find the fountain of youth to stop me from wrinkling along the way, i jsut couldnt come to stomach myself being 400 years old with skin hanging from my flesh and bones. The ironic thing is im a firm believer in god, and the power of intelligent design, but even with that element removed from the equation, i still dont see where this helps us as a global community, i dont see where we progress, rather then jsut becoming overcrowded and subjected to famine and droughts. The world works in its own unique way and as we all can see everytime we try to improve on it throught techonlogy, it comes back to haunt us. Sure we dont have to walk anymore, and we have cars but at what price? Were cars that amazing of an idea now opposed to the time when the Ford T Model had no competion, till now where there are an assortment of options,and a hole in our atmosphere. I may be wrong but i think we should allow technology to grow at its own pace.....we will see the outcome.
Whether christian or a believer in the immortalist through science, one thing is true: you all search for immortality through your own methods.
Let's stop the immature 'my-god-is-bigger-than-your-god' argument and discuss the philosophical pros and cons of longer life... does it essentially answer any questions on life? Does living longer benefit us?
If people live longer, will that benefit our earth?
Will our art and science benefit from people living longer?
Will I benefit from YOU living longer?
So let';s step away from should we do and ask why should we do it. And no, 'just because we can' sucks as an answer.
I don't want to die. I want to live for as long as possible. What more reason do I need to do everything possible to extend my life?
Certainly some people don't want to live forever. If any person wants to die, FINE. Let them. Just don't try to force me to die with them. Perhaps someday I will also want to reach an ending, but the dream of indefinite life extension is to let me CHOOSE when I want to die.
And yes, we'll all benefit from others living longer. Who wouldn't want their friends to live longer along with them?
Science will definitely benefit. Think of all the time "wasted" teaching new people about various scientific fields. If we didn't need to do that, how many more discoveries could we make?
All this about "we can't feed the people we have" is BS. How much food do you waste per month? I know I throw out tons without a second thought. There has been more than enough food produced in the US alone to feed the entire world since about 1960. The ONLY reason that people starve in any country is because of governments. People are very very good at feeding themselves, unless someone with a gun stops the food from getting to them.
Finally, WTF do you mean "is it good for the earth"? This is a meaningless question. If you're talking about the environment, we have the technology to dispose of all human waste in an ecologically neutral way many times over. Even if we didn't, I don't think it's right to tell people they have to DIE just so there can be an extra tree somewhere.
Immortality means everything, their is no point to life if it will be taken away and lost.
This is amazing and frightening to me all at the same time. I'm young, and my personal philosophy is contradictory and amorphous as of now, but I feel saddened to think of us as a species losing our "humanness." I guess this is just another step in the evolutionary ladder? I suppose its not too far fetched when thinking of it in evolutionary terms. I admit my thoughts are riddled with doomsday depictions of such a thing (Terminator, etc). I'm excited to learn more about this! :)
I'm amazed at the small-mindedness inherent in these comment sections. If your life is ruled by an imaginary friend, wouldn't you be better off to go and play with the other kids who are scared of the "devil"?
Please, nutcases, find another playground to piss in.
If and when the technology is created it WILL be set aside for the richest of the world. The only immortals in existence will be those able to afford the health care necessary for the procedure. The rest of the world will have to be content with aging and dying as usual.
I'm sure many in Hollywood especially the really morbid characters into facial reconstructive surgery will jump on the immortal band wagon. There will most likely still be tons of really bad shit going on in the world just like today. But don't fret because human euthanasia will be a community service and you can check out when you want...easily with a cool carbon monoxide chamber...or a nice chemical death cocktail!
Cheers
>If and when the technology is created it WILL be set aside for the richest of the world. The only immortals in existence will be those able to afford the health care necessary for the procedure.
Those countries who would do that will ultimately lost economical competition with those who would give antiageing treatment to everybody. Retirement and age related deceases are overwhelmenly costly in comparison with any kind of medicine.
People...
We may well be able to engineer the body to be perpetually self-repairing and "forever young", although we are still a ways off. However, consider the implications of this. First, I can remember when I was twenty, and am now about twice that age. I have changed so much in those years. How will I be when I am sixty? Eighty? A hundred, two hundred, six hundred... we can talk about how we will react to or deal with indefinite life (I would avoid the term "immortality") but the journey will be different for each of us. And it is not beyond the realm of possibility that you might get to age two hundred or five hundred and just be sick of it. You won't know till you are there. Further, no matter how good this technology gets, there will still be accidents, for instance, and the longer you go in life the more times you may be in a scrape, whether a car accident or a spacecraft accident, and roll snake eyes. So I would think about the afterlife carefully no matter how long I thought I was going to live; but I am a Christian. And if you are not, or an atheist, then I guess you are going to sort things out your own way. I don't see the quest for longer, more vibrant earthly life as inherently in conflict with Christianity, myself.
"i do hope that more religious people think as you do.
i want to live in a future where all religious people have succumbed to old age and have died"
- High five! lol
If this is satanism ... then sign me up. I love science, and I believe we as humans can overcome anything. ... Except maybe an asteroid to the face.
SATANIC BULLSHIT
This is possibly the most satanic thing I have seen in months, and I have
only been in this site for 2 minutes. Immortality is what Satan promised
Eve in the garden of Eden, the Devil told her that if she ate she would be
like a god. Greed is the only thing I can think of when I think of immortality.
If someone is suffering, let them rest in peace.
By the way here are some prophecies for you(not my own but truth)
there are much more natural disasters to come before the end of days.
especially earthquakes.
Actually the snake didn't promise immortality. He promised Eve she would "know of good and evil" and be "like god".
Quit talking about snakes and apples. You are a full-blown idiot to bring the bible into this discussion. Seriously, I get my information from more than one book. Everyone prophesies the end of the Earth, stop watching the news and read a book. Or better yet, reject your god and embrace the flying spaghetti monster.
I think you should read this:
http://bigthink.com/ideas/19170
Today an earthquake hit China, and I read tons of comments like yours, but these comments are written by people who don't know much things about life.
If this is satanism for you, then don't be a part of it. It's that simple. There is nothing wrong to put efforts to try to live indefinitely, just as you do the same. (I assume that you are a christian). Does it mean that you are greedy too?But your beliefs are based on wish thinking, and efforts of scientists are based on evidence and reality.
successful troll is successful, it seems.
"Hail Lucifer!
Dark bringer of light!
Hail Lucifer!
Giver of eternal sight!"
Dissection - God of Forbidden Light
Now the website has something a bit more Satanic!
i do hope that more religious people think as you do.
i want to live in a future where all religious people have succumbed to old age and have died.
Your comment is possibly the most retarded thing I've ever read, and I have only been on this site for 2 minutes. Go back to sniffing glue.
> Immortality is what Satan promised
> Eve in the garden of Eden, the Devil told her that if she ate she would be
> like a god.
Looks like he is going to finally going to deliver. :)
>This is possibly the most satanic thing I have seen in months, and I have
>only been in this site for 2 minutes. Immortality is what Satan promised
>Eve in the garden of Eden, the Devil told her that if she ate she would be
>like a god. Greed is the only thing I can think of when I think of immortality.
>If someone is suffering, let them rest in peace.
Interesting. Do you think as well that we are supposed to take all the deseases that God is sending to us because it is natural for us to get ill? In the XVIII century people would die in the thirties. Do you think we have broken any divine rules now that we live twice as much? Do you think we're going to break any divine rule if we're going to live longer in the future? And do you know exactly how long you have to live before it gets immoral? At which age you're going to break this divine rule and you'd better die instead?
I disagree with "The truth shall be revealed", but FYI Genesis 6:3 says that man will not live longer than 120 years.
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